083 - T-Mobile's Axel Robinson on why love is the answer to operational excellence

Axel Robinson is the business solutions and implementation manager at T-Mobile. In this conversation, Axel highlights how operational excellence paves the way for delivering a world class customer experience, and how showing love for his team is key to his success. 

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Josh:

Hello, and welcome to All Hands on Tech I'm Josh [inaudible 00:00:09]. Today's episode features my conversation with Axel Robinson. Axel is the business solutions and implementation manager at T-Mobile. In this conversation, we break down how operational excellence paves the way delivering a world class customer experience while also showing how his love for his team is the key to his success. Let's take a listen.

Let's just start with your origin story. How did you get into technology? How did you get here?

Axel Robinson:

Well, that's interesting part. Tech for me was I got into engineering by accident actually. I originally went to school for business. That's something that I've always wanted to do from when I was a kid, whether it was selling shoes at school or selling candies to my friend, I've always had that entrepreneurship mindset. So even now I still do some flipping on eBay and things like that. So that part of me has never changed.

So started out, went to school. Actually, I have a background in professional sports. Okay. So previously played professionally soccer here in the US and also in Germany, but we can save that part for another time.

But to answer your question, I started out as an account executive in sales. And I realized that what I was doing did not have any foundation and by foundation, I mean, when you say I want to do a business. Business is very vague, right? You need some kind of centerpiece there to build your business around.

Josh:

Sure. Like something tangible.

Axel Robinson:

Something tangible. Exactly. So I worked for this company that we focused on telecommunication, so that a bread and butter of our business. And I was always fascinated about what was happening on the engineering side. So every time I would walk by, I would check to see what the guys were doing and be very, very curious.

And one day we had a really big project, which since I was on the sales side, I won the project. That was the project of one of my clients. And I ended up, one of the engineers was sick. One of the main engineers was sick. And as you know, my family, we have a huge engineering background.

So I've always heard different words and things in the back of my head unconsciously. So the engineer was sick. We had no one to back him up. So I went up to the CEO and I told him that I think I can step in. Everyone was looking at me like, who's this guy from the sales department who thinks that he could be an engineer. And I said, seriously, I really, really think I can step in and help out. So, they said, okay, fine. That was the beginning of my engineering career.

Josh:

Wow. That is the first one of that kind I've heard. That's awesome. I love that.

Axel Robinson:

I love that. Yeah. So since then, that was the entry level of me becoming an engineer. So then I went back to school and I got my engineering degree. I got my business degree, plus my engineering degree.

Josh:

I mean, I love that they gave you that chance and I love that you just jumped in. So let's talk about where you're at now, a little bit of your role and how you see your role.

Axel Robinson:

Yeah, absolutely. So my current role, I lead a team of 10. We have a team that focuses on the implementation and onboarding experience for all of the T-mobile small businesses, internal and external clients. Okay. So we ensure and we provide a world class implementation experience to all of our new customers.

Josh:

I like that. How do you define world class?

Axel Robinson:

One of the things that you quickly learn when you become an engineer is that you, and it kind of follows you your entire life is you tend to question everything. Right? You ask why. That's what engineers do all the time. They just ask why. Why is this not working? Why is this not working?

And one of my first CEO always told me that if there was no problems, there would be no engineers. So that's something that I've always kept in the back of my mind in terms of problems are actually a good thing. I see problem and I smile because it's an opportunity to do something new or create or be innovative. Right?

So to answer your question, how do I approach my current role? The world class in my current role is a stress free, seamless experience. That is world class, right? Anybody can offer a onboarding experience and an implementation experience, but not everybody can offer a stress free and seamless experience.

So that's what we strive for. That's what I strive for. And that's where you kind of see my love for operational excellence, right? So operational excellence plays right into that. And that's how you become world class, right? So operational excellence for me is one's ability to focus on continuous improvement, right?

You're not necessarily aiming for perfection, but you're aiming for excellence, which means that every single day you are identifying steps within the process that you can improve.

Josh:

Gotcha. So, kind of just little baby steps all the time and constantly iterating.

Axel Robinson:

Yeah, exactly. One of the things I often preach about and I try to get across is constant, constant, incremental improvement. Right. And when I think of operation excellence, that's what I think of. I think of constant incremental improvement, because not only can you impact things outside of your org or your team, but you can also influence, right? And when you have that ability, then that's how you can improve performance in all areas of your team and all areas of your business.

So for me, when I think of pursuing excellence it's about one's ability to separate between where you are today, where you want to go and what are those incremental, constant improvement you can make between those two gap apps to get to your goal.

Josh:

Right. Yeah. I like that. It is difficult sometimes to see the forest for the trees, I guess, where you're kind of just heads down and in the code and then suddenly, you realize that you haven't created that world class experience.

So how do you structure that with your team? Frame this out for me. You got this team of 10, how do you organize them around this idea and get them to rally behind you?

Axel Robinson:

No, that's a very good question. So in terms of operational excellence, what I believe we need is a more comprehensive approach that focus on people and effecting change. Right? Often we focus on the process, but not so much on the people working the process or the people doing the process, right? So operational excellence need to happen with the team in the next interest of your team and of organization.

So great teams that do not have a clear vision of where they want to go, you can see that there's a lot of roadblocks that they have to go through. So it's about having a clear vision of where they want to go, where you want to go with your team, and have the ability to attack and anticipate change. Because if you can anticipate the change, then you can maneuver through all the roadblocks.

Josh:

Ooh, I love that. So how do you anticipate change?

Axel Robinson:

So anticipate change is by something that I like to call and people, if you talk to me for few days, you realize this is something that I preach about often is something I like to call predictable issues and challenges, right. There is a great book by, I forgot the author, but I have it on my desk. It's called the name of the book is "How Did I Let That Happen?" Right. And what that book does, it talks about accountability and how one needs to take ownership of things that happen to them. Right?

So one thing that I try to do in my personal life and in work as well is identify predictable issues, right? So one predictable issue since we're talking right now is that my laptop was not properly charged right before the call. So a predictable issue here is that the probability of my computer dying is very, very high.

Josh:

I love this. If you need to go grab your charger don't hesitate.

Axel Robinson:

If you give me one second.

Josh:

Yes.

Axel Robinson:

Okay, perfect. I'm back. So I actually walked right into that example, but it's...

Josh:

And you answered it so seamlessly, you started out just saying here's a good example. Yeah, that was perfect.

Axel Robinson:

So, your question was how do you anticipate change is one's ability to identify predictable issues and challenges within the process. So again, I'll give you a simple example of my charger, but that same example could be applied in any area of our life.

So if you have a project that you're working on, first thing you do, you identify the risk, but even within the risk, you should ask yourself, what are the predictable risk? Because a lot of things can be predicted. If you don't do X, then Y happens. If you don't do Y, then this happens. So once you identify all of those, then you future proof it. Doing so allows you to anticipate change.

Josh:

Yeah, no, I really like that approach because it's one of those things where when someone tells it to you, you're like, oh yeah, that makes sense. But if you're not, like we were talking about with forest for the trees, texting, it's like, unless you're consciously making that effort, it can get very difficult to predict those changes and to anticipate problems or like you said, you don't like to focus on the problem, but anticipate roadblocks that you can navigate around and how to make it better through that process.

Axel Robinson:

Yeah. Predict. So, one thing that I have my team do is before any project, I said, what are the predictable issues and challenges that we can possibly encounter? And when something happened, the first question that I have everyone ask themself is it's not about why, what the other person did, but the question everyone should ask is how did I let that happen? So "how did I let that happen" forces you to take full ownership of the situation. And once you have ownership of the situation you're in full control of it, right?

Josh:

That's a really good insight on just, I mean, team culture. I mean, I always ask questions about team culture and how to create a culture of everyone should take ownership and everyone needs to reinforce each other and that, but I feel like this is a good building block to set that culture on.

Since we're on the topic of culture, how do you orient the team around the goals that you feel like sort of north star? Where are you going? And then back it up and figure out how to?

Axel Robinson:

Yeah. I think one of the most difficult thing in a leadership position is change, right? No one likes change. No matter how old they are, nobody likes change. No matter how small the change is. So for me, I truly believe is that is everyone within a team has to see themself in a vision. It cannot be just your vision of where the company needs to go, where the team needs to go.

So, let's say you were taking a man to the moon, right. If you're working on NASA or something like that, and you were the janitor.

Josh:

Sure.

Axel Robinson:

The janitor, whether you cleaning the bathroom or you're sweeping the floor, you know why you're doing what you're doing. So, you know the why behind the why. Right? And I think that in order to have the team to buy in into that north star that you're referring to, is them not only understanding the why behind the why, but it's also them seeing themselves in that vision. It's much easier for people to buy into something when they can see themselves within the process.

Josh:

Yeah. So that's awesome. So how do you show them? You know what I mean?

Axel Robinson:

Yeah. So the one thing that I've realized is that everybody want and needs something, regardless of what level and their position, everybody want and needs something. So it is identifying people's needs and connecting that to the vision. That's how people start to buy into things. They may not necessarily see themself, but I can tell you one simple example, someone wants to make more money. Everybody does. You have someone on the team who wants to make more money and they feel that they got to get to the next step, right? In order to make that extra cash.

One way to get them to buy into the vision is very simple. If the team does well, more opportunities for everyone, because it means high visibility. And it means that more people will shine. If the team doesn't do well, it's very difficult to get buy in from any other teams for you to get a chance.

So in order for you to get that raise you're looking for, or that extra cash you're looking for, we need to be in a position of success. So it's a win-win. If we succeed, you shine, you get what you need. And as a team, we all shine.

Josh:

Yeah. I really like how you, I noticed you used the word we this whole time. And I really like that aspect of not just saying, "Hey, you need to perform and you will get more money." It's like, "Hey, we all need to step in and play a part so that we can all be where we need to be and show everyone that we've got what it takes to take it to the next level or to get that raise or promotion."

Axel Robinson:

Yeah. One of my favorite, even in my signature at work, there's this African proverb that I love. And I get a lot of compliment from it from my colleagues. At first, people were laughing at me because people didn't really understand it, but later on, it started to catch on all the way to the VP level, is if you want to go fast, you go alone. If you want to go far, we go together. That's the mentality that when you talk about the culture, the cultures built around that, right?

You want to go fast, you go alone. You want to go far. So going fast is very shortsighted. Going far is thinking long term impact. There's a great book by Simon Sinek. It's called "The Infinite Game." You probably read it.

Josh:

Yeah, I have.

Axel Robinson:

Right. So that whole strategy is playing the long game, right. Playing and then not only how are you succeeding, but how your success opens doors for other folks that are coming behind you.

Josh:

Well, and it also kind of brings up, I remember in that book, and I'm curious your thoughts, but when you're talking about your role being you're providing world class onboarding. So I just remember in that book, it's a lot about he shows a lot of examples of companies that will cut corners to make a buck versus companies or organizations that go the exact opposite way, where they're willing to spend way more money than anyone initially thought was wise.

And it ends up handing out, it just explodes their growth because of this long game mentality. I'm just curious how that plays into the way that you see your role in serving for this onboarding?

Axel Robinson:

Yeah. I think first of all, I think being in my role is a privilege. Let me start with that. It's a blessing to be in a position to... Leadership is a blessing. To be in a position to serve. Right. When I first took on the team, and this is the first thing I said to at them, I say, I'm here to serve you. It's not the other way around. Let's get that right off the bat. I'm in a position to serve.

So to answer your question is that you are in a position to positively impact someone's future, which means that you are giving them the tools they need, not just for where they are today and hopefully when they leave your team and they want to do something else.

Because I hope the objective is to help people grow, right? That should be the intent, right. To help people get where they need to be in their life. Because the reality is they're not going to stay on your team their entire career. Right. But when they're ready to go through that next step, did you prepare them enough for them to succeed?

So that's when I think of that long term game, that infinite game that we're talking about, it's really, that. It's understanding that the time that I have with you is temporary because you may want to do something else, which is okay. Right. It's totally okay. But I just want to make sure that whatever that something else is for you, I'm helping you get toward that

Josh:

With all this, before we started recording you, you'd brought up leadership is around love. It's like that four letter word love, but it's not the mushy kind. Let's talk about that a little bit and how this plays into this, the long game and this customer-centric product building, because I feel like they're also intertwined.

Axel Robinson:

Yep. No, I think that's a good question. I think again, that four letter word is a word that people often, it's rarely, it's almost nonexistent in the workspace. But as I mentioned to you earlier, we are often told to love our customers. We're often told to love the product that we sell. Right.

But what about the people that we work with? Don't they matter, right? Those are the folks that you spend more time with them than you do with your own family. So that love that I'm referring to is if you look in a dictionary, I think is the fourth, it's the fourth, depending on which dictionary you have, but it's the fourth definition in the dictionary and it's pretty much the unselfish benevolence for someone else.

Right. And having that ability to care beyond just the numbers, because driving result is extremely hard. It's very hard actually. And then talking about love and caring for people at the same, it's even harder. Right. But I truly believe that those two can easily be combined because one of the craziest thing about leadership, you often think you're leading people, but it's more of a self discovery. As you get deeper into it, you realize that you are learning more about yourself and your own personal value than you are leading people and what you stand for and what you won't stand for.

So the love portion of things is really having a care for one another. And just from a human being's perspective, right? We live in a world today where so much hate, so much darkness, so much people are stressed. There's so many things that are going on and love is the source of everything, right? And that's the way that we should carry. It doesn't make sense to show love to your customers, but not your colleagues.

Josh:

That is a fascinating take on how to create a good culture.

Axel Robinson:

And what that does is helps others to refine their vision and purpose in life. And I think ultimately when you are in a position that I'm in or anybody else is in, that should be your ultimate goal. And I'm not saying that should be your only goal, but at least that should be something that you strive for.

Josh:

On this same track, how do you show a colleague or your team that you love them? Because it sounds like you're building a family.

Axel Robinson:

Yeah. It's really, really hard because this is sometime intent and impact can vary, right? Sometime you can have the right intent, the right intention, but then the impact can be something else. Right? So the key here I believe is to align the intent and the impact of your message so that it resonate across the board and it's about selflessness, right?

And you still have to deliver. Don't get me wrong. I think sometimes when I say this to people, they think that you're not result driven. You still have to deliver.

Josh:

Yeah. You're not just hanging out in the office, giving hugs out.

Axel Robinson:

Right. Exactly. You still have to deliver, you still have to do what you have to do, but it's coming more from an area of like the quote that I mentioned earlier of that togetherness and one's ability to be able to think beyond just what I'm doing, but how what I'm doing is impacting everyone else around me and how that's helping us to drive result.

Josh:

Yeah. So being really deliberate on your actions.

Axel Robinson:

Not only that and I think very genuine, right. We live in a world where when you do something nice for someone, they automatically assume you want something.

Josh:

Yep.

Axel Robinson:

It's very transactional. So how do we move from that transactional way of behaving toward each other toward more of a genuine way. And so when we talk about love, right? It's the source of who we are. It's the source of everything that we do.

If I'm asking you, "Hey Josh, how you feeling today?" And it's really because I really want to know how you feel. Not just if I'm asking you, "Hey, do you need help?" It's really because I truly want to help. Not because I'm asking you just to pretend like I'm helping. So love in that sense is about being genuine toward each other and having compassion, being very compassionate toward one another.

Especially in times like this, it's easy to look at the pain and loss and suffering and hardship of everybody and call it a mess. Right. But the key here is not just that, but it's what role or what part or what can I do within that process to ensure that everyone is winning, right?

Josh:

How does that manifest in the structure of your meetings or just your team dynamic? I'm just curious, operationally, if you were telling another leader how you've done this and the successes you've found, how would you explain that to them?

Axel Robinson:

It's very difficult to do. It's very difficult to do because one, because of some of the reasons that I've mentioned earlier about people naturally, not naturally but to some extent, not being genuine in people's actions, in their actions.

So when you are genuine in things that you do, when people don't know you are first, like I said, they question, there's a lot of question mark around. Why is he so nice to me? Why does he care so much? Why is he asking me, how am I doing? Well, everyone always put up these walls, right? Because people are always strategically thinking of transactional mindset. Right?

So to answer your question, how do I go about actually doing that? I would say first is authenticity because it's not something you can fake. If I had a colleague who was going through something like that, I would say first, make sure that that is something that you attempt to do. I'm not saying that you are going to be perfect at it. You're not. Right. You are going to have days where you're going to have to maybe put people in their place, which is normal, right?

You're going to have time where you need to have very candid conversation with folks, right. And sometime not everyone is going to buy in. History has proven that when people feel appreciated and cared for regardless of their level, they are more likely to go above and beyond.

And that's the key here is for people to feel appreciated and careful.

Josh:

Wow. I love that. So we're almost at time. I feel like I learned so much from you, but I want to give you an opportunity to offer up some insights to your fellow leaders. Just if you have any kind of parting words or any last thoughts that you have, just let you run with it.

Axel Robinson:

Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Man. That's a though one. I think I can write a book on this, but I don't even think I'm in a position to give advice because I'm always learning. And I feel like I have so much more to learn, but it would be more toward the privilege and the blessing it is to be in a position of leadership. I think that's something not to take lightly because what you say, what you do, how you treat people sometime influence the direction of their life.

So that's a huge responsibility to have on your shoulder. Hence the reason why it's important to show love, show gratitude, and really care for one another because you play an important role in people's life and life decisions and their overall objective in life.

Josh:

Axel, I really appreciate the time.

Axel Robinson:

I just want to say huge, huge, thank you to you.

Josh:

Thanks for listening to All Hands on Tech. To see the show notes and more info. Visit pluralsight.com/podcast.