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Prove Learning ROI Like a Regulator

with Matt Lloyd Davies • September 29, 2026

Episode overview

"Budget tells me what you intended to do. Activity tells me what people did. But neither tells me whether the organization is now more capable." 

Before he built offensive security courses at Pluralsight, Matt Lloyd Davies regulated the UK civil nuclear sector — the skeptical stakeholder whose job was deciding whether the capability an organization claimed was really there. In this episode, we apply that standard of proof to L&D. 

We cover why the easiest things to measure are the least useful, the three questions that turn learning into a business case, how to answer the "correlation isn't causation" objection, why the "train them and they leave" fear gets it backwards, and how to get executives to define the standard of proof up front. 

Matt Lloyd Davies is a Principal Security Author at Pluralsight. He holds a PhD in mathematical chemistry and worked in explosives safety research, London 2012 Olympic security, and UK civil nuclear regulation before moving into learning.

Connect with Matt Lloyd Davies on Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/matt-lloyddavies/
Pluralsight courses: https://www.pluralsight.com/authors/matthew-lloyddavies
How to measure and prove upskilling ROI (Youtube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLs1F7Ydn-E

Chapters

01:22 From Chemistry to Nuclear Regulation to Pluralsight

03:15 What "Proof of Capability" Means to a Regulator

06:48 Why Proving L&D ROI Feels So Hard

08:32 Start With the Business Problem, Not the Program

11:19 Three Questions That Prove Learning ROI

14:34 Handling the "Correlation Isn't Causation" Objection

17:12 "What If We Train Them and They Leave?"

18:21 Hands-On Labs as the Evidence Layer

19:28 Winning Executive Buy-In Before the Program Is Built

23:56 Security as the ROI Wedge

25:16 Measurement Cadence and Course Corrections

29:24 Two Practical Changes to Make Right Now

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